BUGA Community
General Category => CF Bedford Chat => Topic started by: Bas / NZ on December 04, 2011, 05:38:04 PM
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Help please I have a VN v6 3.8 in my Black Beddie, have put a new Radiator (VR ) filler cap on top, the proplem even after a short run the radiator water level drops a lot, done a pressure test no leaks, my guess it is going out through the over flow bottle? but why, this is the set up that was in the van when I got it. Going by photo's on the net there seems to be a bypass hose going back to the heater or something? Cap is 13lbs or 13 something , I am told this is correct, if I run the van a short distance and take the cap of there is pressure and the water in the radiator is full, but after cool down it's empty, aleast a litre, the over flow bottle is still at the same level. 2 things I guess might be happening, to much pressure in the radiator forceing it out through the overflow ( but no signs of this), or a leak through the radiator cap not allowing the water to return on cool down, have replaced cap and as I said pressure in the ratiator after a shot run.
Ideas Please............ Thanks ;)
Photo's of the set up
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had something similar
turned out to be the water pump had gone belly up
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Water pump new............ Thanks
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check you have the right type of rad. cap (over flow type)
make sure your overflow bottle is vented, to check this pull the hose out of the bottle (or just sit it in) and run the engine to running temp. i had this problem, the over flow bottle was syphoning the water out
check head gasket
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check you have the right type of rad. cap (over flow type)
make sure your overflow bottle is vented, to check this pull the hose out of the bottle (or just sit it in) and run the engine to running temp. i had this problem, the over flow bottle was syphoning the water out
check head gasket
Thanks, will check it out tomorrow, had the overflow pipe just sitting in an old bottle and it still did the same, not sure if this bottle is vented, came out of the Camper, worked fine in there, Head gasket, hope not, no signs of this oil clear etc, type of cap, ok, thought there was only one type?
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Baz i have 2 vps and one vn commy. All of them have 2 hoses going to the overflow tank.Now i have read on one of the commy forums that the vn series motor has a low pressure system and the later serieis vp-vr-vs has the high pressure system. I will duck out tomorrow and have a look at my old vn and see if i can spot any differences between mine and yours. cheers....johnno
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just a thought is the new cap seating correctly on the top lip of the radiator. if its not sealed it will suck air back instead of water.
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Baz i have 2 vps and one vn commy. All of them have 2 hoses going to the overflow tank.Now i have read on one of the commy forums that the vn series motor has a low pressure system and the later serieis vp-vr-vs has the high pressure system. I will duck out tomorrow and have a look at my old vn and see if i can spot any differences between mine and yours. cheers....johnno
Thanks, that would be great. The VN radiator does not have a cap on it must be filled from the reservoir bottle that has the cap on it?
PICS BELOW
1 / VN
2/ VP
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just a thought is the new cap seating correctly on the top lip of the radiator. if its not sealed it will suck air back instead of water.
Yes it is sitting well, had the same thought, but if I take it off after a little run there is alot of pressure in there, so the cap must be sealing right.
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take it to mechanic and get test done (colour test), that will check if any co2 in the water from blown head gasket
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take it to mechanic and get test done (colour test), that will check if any co2 in the water from blown head gasket
Thanks David, but a drive down to the garage and back ( you know how far this is, 2 min) will allow it to drop on cooldown, if it was leaking through the head I would have more water than oil in the motor, but thanks will check it out
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Does the motor run slightly rough? I saw a V6 with a water leak last week. It was leaking to the piston and out the exhaust hence no water in the oil.
Mike
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Does the motor run slightly rough? I saw a V6 with a water leak last week. It was leaking to the piston and out the exhaust hence no water in the oil.
Mike
Thanks Mike, motor runs sweet, idles nice, when I did the timming gear did a compression test all even and good..........
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Ok update, tried most of these things, no water out the exhaust at opperating temp, no differance when overflow sitting in a bottle at OT, now can run the motor with cap on and when I remove it water flows out, leave cap off and keep motor running, water level seems to stay ok, stop motor leave cap off and water level drops ??? No water going out the overflow, looks like it's a park up for the van, untill I find an answer, David will get the motor checked out again at the mechanics today, luky hes a friend...........
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MMMmmm im wondering whether you have a dodgey thermostat or have an air lock in the system? :-\ :-\
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Is it actually loosing water or is the level just varying ? is it overheating ?
I know in the 202 its common for the level to rise under rev's and drop back down at idle/switched off.
Warren
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Thanks Warren, at this stage looking at an air lock in the system, not over heating, have replaced the cap from Holden this time, done test on motor no signs of water there, no water out the exhaust. Can only be an airlock in the system, there is a bleed screw somewhere, will search old holden to find out how to do it, will keep you informed incase it happens to someone else on here. Cheers
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"Never remove a thermostat as this can cause coolant to circulate too rapidly reducing its ability to dissipate heat causing overheating. It can also cause over cooling. Overcooling can cause excessive fuel usage usually shown by black soot on the rear of the car. As an example the Holden Commodore V6 engine has an air bleed system incorporated into the top radiator hose/ thermostat housing to release air pocket.As the engine is higher than the radiator it is possible that air bubbles may remain trapped causing the coolant to sit on top of the trapped air giving a false impression that the coolant is full. To overcome this use an empty bottle with the bottom cut out to allow the coolant level to be higher than the engine, thus forcing any trapped air out of the bleed hole. +
this might not work as looking at your photos your heater is way higher that the top hose so you might have to incorperate a bleed valve as high as possible
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Ok seems problem fixed, did a flush to remore any air, replaced the cap with a return one (thank you for that info David) took it for a couple of drives, water drops a little , if you look in the top of the tank it tappers a bit so seems to be holding at this level where it stops, 100ml to to it up, so happy with this level. So beddie back on the road, can now move on to my twin exhaust system. :o and face the problems this will bring.......... ???
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can now move on to my twin exhaust system. :o and face the problems this will bring.......... ???
Hey Bas, where are you splitting it? Are you taking seperate pipes from the engine or are you splitting it before the rear mufflers? I thought about splitting mine before the rear mufflers.
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can now move on to my twin exhaust system. :o and face the problems this will bring.......... ???
Hey Bas, where are you splitting it? Are you taking seperate pipes from the engine or are you splitting it before the rear mufflers? I thought about splitting mine before the rear mufflers.
Going seperate pipes all the way down, yes I can fit it in the tail pipe will finish behind the back tyre to the side, I like this look from the back ( and leaves the rear open still for the spare). A couple of photo's sorry it's dark outside now but you can still see what I mean, the twin system will run down the left side of the van and will consit of 2 x Coby / grey ones and 2x Flow Master at the rear before the diff and split out to each side once over the diff, will also run a couple of X Pipes (photo attached) to balance the exhaust and to help the flow and improve the sound, have seen this set up on a v6 before, it comes close to an 8 :D
Will be doing this over the xmas break, so will set up a video on here of start up for the sound effect........
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Cool, I'll look forward to it. I can't fit my spare in now due to the jag so that's not an issue for me. Think I'm going to mount it on the back wall inside the van. I thought about splitting the pipes behind the gearbox and then taking each pipe over the diff and out the back. Just ideas I'm toying with. Could put twin tips on the end of each pipe for added wank factor. Think I'm gonna buy me a new MIG too. Will see how finances shape up in the new year.
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Could put one of these on and have the best of both worlds. ;)
Varex remote control muffler. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7jGYnhbQQU#ws)
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Could do this, yea right............
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Honestly I wonder sometimes what goes through some people's heads. ::)
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Anyone know where to get a set of Extractors for my Holden v6 3.8 in New Zealand.......... ???
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Nothing on Trade Me?
http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/SearchResults.aspx?searchType=all&searchString=holden+v6+extractors&type=Search&generalSearch_keypresses=20&generalSearch_suggested=0 (http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/SearchResults.aspx?searchType=all&searchString=holden+v6+extractors&type=Search&generalSearch_keypresses=20&generalSearch_suggested=0)
Mike
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Might have to run my new exhaust system through the standard headers, don't need any power gains has enough but the better fuel would of been nice.
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Ok. JP'S Proformance does them, but at $700.00, think I will stay with the Headers >:(
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Anyone know where to get a set of Extractors for my Holden v6 3.8 in New Zealand.......... ???
Just about everywhere. They're advertised on Trademe all the time.
This guy advertises all the time...
http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/car-parts-accessories/performance/exhaust/auction-430615629.htm (http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/car-parts-accessories/performance/exhaust/auction-430615629.htm)
I found 3 different second-hand sets last week but they're not on now.
Road & Track in the Hutt quoted me $500.00 earlier in the year for the Coby brand.
Actually the guy on Trademe who does your X-Pipe states in his auction they deal with Coby as well so why not ask him for a price.
http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/car-parts-accessories/performance/exhaust/auction-431356036.htm (http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/car-parts-accessories/performance/exhaust/auction-431356036.htm)
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Thanks, have got quoted $550.00 from a company on Trade Me aswell, but not sure what brand, but thinking do I need them, at the moment the two headers go into one, so the flow is not great, but if I run two seperate pipes ( duel system) from the headers this flow will incress alot, just not sure it is worth the money. My worked 202 runs them, but here I was trying to get as much power out of it for proformance, but with the 3.8 v6 this is not the case, more than enough power left standard. As for the last guy in your list that does the X-Pipe, this is who I delt with for my system, they are very good to deal with and used them in the past, postage was well priced so no need to buy local.
Cheers Bas
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I'm fairly keen to do mine but need to find out whether they extend any further horizontally out from the engine than the stock headers as I have a limited amount of room to the side due to the midmount so if you buy some you can tell me! 8)
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Yea, we all have a limited amount of room and I guess money I'm up to a grand as it is on the Exhaust and that's just for the parts....... and not my time putting it all together.
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Bas, I can't wait to hear how your van sounds with the new setup.
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Bas, I can't wait to hear how your van sounds with the new setup.
Gordon, all this to try and make it sound like yours ;) emailed stu re; diff drop off at your place but heard nothing yet.
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I'm going to start gathering my exhaust bits shortly. I won't be assembling it till next winter so that gives me a bt of time to find the right bits at the right price.
Bought myself a 3 ton trolley jack this afternoon that I'm looking forward to using in anger and keeping an eye out for a better MIG than the one I've got for a good price too.
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I just got the 2 cobies behind my V6 and it sounds nice (single pipe), exhaust exits in front of rear wheel
on the subject of VN radiators, when i did my conversion i sent the rad in to get cleaned - it was stuffed but the radiator guy had the old VN tin type (inside of the plastic), which is like the earlier commodores. we just put a filler cap on top of the side tank. works a treat