BUGA Community
General Category => CF Bedford Chat => Topic started by: petrolhead on September 06, 2010, 09:46:41 AM
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At the Fathers day hot Rod Show I caught up with Trevor Breeze from Vintage Rod & Custom and was talking to him about the down side to a Beddi's brakes & steering. Simple solution is to fit Jag front & rear crossmember/suspension, now you will end up with 4 wheel disc brakes, coil over suspension, power steering(rack & pinion), common wheel stud pattern & if you are really serious you can buy a jag housing that accepts a Ford 9 inch centre. Trevor has fitted Jag front & suspensions to lots of rods and he could fit them to your van. He suggested that if there was some intrest he could develop a kit so that you could bolt it in yourself. For this to happen he would need to borrow a Beddie and hear from you guys. Trevor can be contacted on
Ph: 94196001
Fax: 94191830
e-mail: vinrod@bigpond.com
Regards
Petrolhead
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DAMN!!!! why didnt I think of that ;D
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Yeah Neil....You are letting the side down buddy c'mon chop chop.. ;D :D ;D :D ;D
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I would imagine that even to develop a kit this would be very expensive as everything has to be widened. That creates major problems with the steering rack etc. It sounds simple in Petrolhead's description but I would think that with the engineering involved the expense would put it well out of reach of most people. Just the diff is costly enough.
Correct me if I'm wrong Merlin.
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If Ian does not mind, what sort of problems did you have with your rear end, and what sort of cost were you looking at, in yours though, everything is nicely polished, so i guess that is an added cost. I would love to be able to buy a complete kit that bolts on, the idea of late model and 4 wheel disc brakes is great.
I now have 4wheel disc brakes and power steering, but mine is a mix of a few cars, my mechanic is going to do up a manual for me with all the cars, models, and numbers so that i will know what car each part came off. This is the down side, the up side, i can stroll into ford or holden and buy a part new off the shelf, bolt it in and i am away. In part this is what is takeing so long, we have had to pioneer most of ours, and get it engineered and approved. Worth it though, i am going to enjoy cruising in it when it is done. For me this is a one off, i will never get the chance to do it again, so.
george.
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When I was Building my '48 Ford Club Coupe I bought an unregistered XJ6 Jag for $650.00 ratted out what I needed and sold the rest of it for $220.00 so it's not so pricey, has anybody measured the track of the Beddie against the Jag?A simple solution & cheaper to widening(or narrowing) the front & rear ends is to get some rims with the correct back spacing to suit, problem solved & as you were saying no higgly piggly parts list just simple over the counter parts
[ftp]Regards
Petrolhead
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id be interesred in one of those kits too :D
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When I was Building my '48 Ford Club Coupe I bought an unregistered XJ6 Jag for $650.00 ratted out what I needed and sold the rest of it for $220.00 so it's not so pricey, has anybody measured the track of the Beddie against the Jag?A simple solution & cheaper to widening(or narrowing) the front & rear ends is to get some rims with the correct back spacing to suit, problem solved & as you were saying no higgly piggly parts list just simple over the counter parts
[ftp]Regards
Petrolhead
I'm in the middle of doing a jag rear for mine. If I'd stuck with the standard axles the offset on the wheels would have been so much that I probably wouldn't of got it certified. There is a substantial difference in width.
Also you can't try that kind of trick on the front. You'd have to cut most of the front out to allow the wheels to turn and I can guarantee you wouldn't get that certified. You'd have problems with mounting points as well with a standard width Jag front crossmember.
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This'll give you an idea of the difference in rear axle lengths. The top one has been modified for the Bedford. The bottom is a standard XJ6/XJS axle.
Remember that the greater the offset of the wheel the more stress that is placed on the wheel studs and the end of the axle.
(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d16/Rogue1234/Diff/AxleDifference.jpg)
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I'm running standard XJ6 jag diff in my custom but I was lucky/unlucky that I got an oddball stud pattern on my rear mags.
Am running deep dish 15x10 on the back with (25mm) adaptors and bigger wheel studs, this brings it to the same width with 14x8 on the front.
I doubt the kit could be done for under 6 grand, and it wouldn't be a bolt in thing as just the diff needs the braces and stuff cut out of the van and the A arms and bits welded on, brake lines need to be changed at diff and front end as well as a disc/disc brake booster master cly.
The front, well thats a major and would probably be cheaper to use early model L300 front as this is what a lot of hot rodders use, if they use the jag they usually just use the arms and spindles.
Also if you don't get a good diff, it will cost about $1500 to reco it, plus the 4 shocks and springs ...
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the XJS suspension (the widest available) is 45mm narrower than the beddy useing 25mm reverse offset rims the mounting kit for the rear would not be very hard to do but the front end is a bit more complicated as the control arms cant towards the back the rack must be mounted on the rear of the crossmemberso linking it to the column becomes a challenge ( Ihave two bevel boxes in mine) also the mounting for the upper control arms has to be reversed otherwise you cant bolt the arms up or fit the shims for the alignment I am in the middle of mounting mine and YES I am taking lotsa photos Cheers Neil
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XJS series 3
they come out in two sizes, also an early and later model. they can be told apart from the discs as the early ones look like they have a metal rod welded around the disc. even the later model one has a issue with handbrake lever inserts, they should be replaced with the later model ratchet type ones for auto adjusting
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hey busy do these have any id marks on them, am looking at one at the moment, appears to be out of a xjs coupe but not sure cheers stevo ;D ;D
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Steveo, they usually have tags on the diff head, not sure on id marks as such.
doing a search on google, i found a couple of links
http://www.ozrodders.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=413742&sid=0671ba36e90d74325c827e0182dc6547 (http://www.ozrodders.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=413742&sid=0671ba36e90d74325c827e0182dc6547) (just look at the pictures on how it's mounted, the center can/should be rubber mounted to stop vibration and the traction bars are set up correctly, having them running straight and the rear tends to steer)
http://www.canoeyawl.com/SCHR/images-cobra/RE-complete.jpg (http://www.canoeyawl.com/SCHR/images-cobra/RE-complete.jpg) later model
http://www.cripple.tk/wp-content/gallery/jag-diff-fabricationinstall/img_8022.jpg (http://www.cripple.tk/wp-content/gallery/jag-diff-fabricationinstall/img_8022.jpg) early model
sorry i couldnt find very good pictures, but if you look at the edge of the disc you'll see the early one is rounded, in person it looks like it has a rod between the plates
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Trev can do L300 fronts as well, got any questions give him a call
Regards
Petrolhead
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There's also a doco in the 'Technical Documentation' section in 'Downloads' that has information on setting up the Jag rear end.
Here are another couple of examples of Bedford mounted Jag rears The top one was taken at a Garden City Grovel in Christchurch around 1990 I think and the bottom one belonged to a member of our club. He ended up moving to Christchurch and that was the last we heard of him. CfJeff might have more info. I'm kicking myself now that I didn't take more photos while I had the chance.
If you look closely at the bottom picture you can see where the bottom arms were lengthened.
(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d16/Rogue1234/Diff/ChristchurchJaga.jpg)
(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d16/Rogue1234/Diff/PetesJaga.jpg)
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(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d16/Rogue1234/Diff/Diff.jpg)
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thanks busy and rogue great help cheers stevo ;D
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hey petrolhead wot mean u by one can do L300 fronts ??? i am fusedcon please explain as hav a L300 sittin in paddock . ta
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hey petrolhead wot mean u by one can do L300 fronts ??? i am fusedcon please explain as hav a L300 sittin in paddock . ta
Here's a suggestion. Just for once why don't you try typing using proper English and grammar instead of raving on like a blithering imbecile!
And while we're about it stop polluting serious threads with your crap. Unless you have something relevant to add don't bother.
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What he means Skip, is they use L300 front ends under rods and etc.. but there to narrow for a beddy l think .. It's a good way to get a ball joint front end, good size ventellated disc's and steering. We put one under a 46 ford tudor (also good for right hand drive conversion)... ;D ;D
it could be a good way to lower the shit out of a Beddy, if the wish bones clear ::) ::)
I LIKE A LAUGH
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Far out Rogue you really dont like that abbreviated writing aye, I noticed you went off about it in another topic. Well I got no probs with it Skippy, different folks different stokes I guess :)
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Sorry but I've put up with it for long enough. No other forum tolerates it and it brings down the tone of the whole forum. I logged on this morning and 4 out of the 5 unread posts was this rubbish. A bit of fun is great but this is just unmitigated crap and I think it's time for it to end.
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hey shane, maybe on the new site you could have a [skippy translation button] for rogue, when skip does a post, just hit translate. oooppss ;D ;D ;D sorry skippy mate.
george.
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I'm with you Rogue, we are all adults here not teenagers who don't know better or just can't be bothered
please treat us as such!
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Lighten up guys if you dont like his posts its easy DONT READ EM!! i think that reaction was a bit over the top i mean next you're gonna have a go at swearing oar mi spellering ore sumfink .
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Lighten up guys if you dont like his posts its easy DONT READ EM!! i think that reaction was a bit over the top i mean next you're gonna have a go at swearing oar mi spellering ore sumfink .
thats me.. sorry skippy but i dont read your posts cause it strains my brain..
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On a lighter note... all you non teenage old bugas ;) check this out below its awesome!
I cdnuolt blveiee that I cluod aulaclty uesdnatnrd what I was rdanieg,. The phaonmneal pweor of the human mind. Aoccdrnig to a rscheearch at Cmabridge Uineriety, it deosn?t mttaer in what order the ltteers in a word are, the only iprmoatnt thing is that the frist and lsat ...ltteer arein the rghit pclae.
Not quite the same as abbreviated words but pretty interesting?
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As one of the old Buggas here, I do prefer to read proper words, and sometimes struggle a bit with other forms of speech.
Rogue, you are a serious person and a great asset to this board with your serious and informative posts. Please try to be tolerant of others who may have a more light hearted approach..
And Skippy....lol... I can see his point; please cool it a bit mate.
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I'm like ben, I don't read them either.
Anyways back to the jag rears ....
I was doing a search on google images for jag rear ends and came across this web site full of old 70's and 80's hot rod pictures (think it was a UK site), just about every second "vehicle" had a jag rear, and alot had the 4x4 look because of them. we haven't really come far in terms of what was done back then.
Sadly my computer froze on me and am unable to find the site again, had some radical customs - prefects, vw's, cortinas, morries, and all the usual model A's etc.
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been researching aswell busy and found a american site with some real cool pics wich i will post however found some other info too
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Sorry Skip, I'm with Rouge, the odd word here and there ok, but not every or every second word, I do the odd word but that's because I wasen't watching what I was typing and spelt it wrong. :D When I lived over there for 2 years, this seems to be the way our Brothers talk............
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? sorry hit the wrong button
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Sorry but I've put up with it for long enough. No other forum tolerates it and it brings down the tone of the whole forum. I logged on this morning and 4 out of the 5 unread posts was this rubbish. A bit of fun is great but this is just unmitigated crap and I think it's time for it to end.
javol!! mein underslitchenstuhrmannfuhrer..i vill not ask stupid qvenstions again on der L300 fronts ever! JA? :P
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dearest bretheren, i from the bottom of my carefree heart am, yet sorry again, for my misunderstood humour. :'( , i usually write th way i speak .. im from essex where we drop many letters from our oral vocabulary) i can of course spell in the full lustre and expanse of correspondance,and indeed with grammer icons included...for you, and you only rouge, my dear fellow, i promise, sincerly to in future, adopt a politically correct manner to all grammical references in the threads therein, from this moment onwards, but , alas, my dear, dear, fellow, cannot comply, let alone comprehend, with your desires for me to eradicate the emotion of mirth from my thoughts, and/or threads if an opportunity arises to make even one person on this site smile (at what age should the child inside wither and die ? for mine hasnt yet. for this, i am eternally gratefull). i am what i am, and accept all others, as they are ,even the serious.,which is why i am now being serious. ("very serious" icon inserted.) i totally agree with ben and busy.. thank u ;D ;) now, to quote busy,.. back to the jag rear ends and cheers for the info on the L300 query rossie. onya cobber ;)
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HAHAHAHA F#@$%KN Touche Skippy Touche ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D........ on the subject of L300 f/ends they can be adapted to the iconic Bedford but it needs to be widened and a suitable rack mounted ( L300 run draglink/bellcrank steering ) they are F.F.F.Ford pattern but you can buy undrilled rotors .also they have two different cradles the comercial one is the strongest .I have done one of these conversions but I wasnt happy with it as there is very little tunability in them this is why I designed my Jag/Bedford f/end (Craig Put some picks on here of it a while back) It is fully adjustable including track width I just have to sort out the third arms to finsh it Cheers Neil
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(http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x234/craigc327/Bedfords1122008045.jpg)
(http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x234/craigc327/Bedfords1122008044.jpg)
(http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x234/craigc327/Bedfords1122008043.jpg)
(http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x234/craigc327/Bedfords1122008042.jpg)
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Onya Skip. 8)
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i noticed on that last photo the engine mount is welded straight to the crossmember, my bedy was like that and had fractures around the base of the weld so when i renewed the mounts i welded a flat base plate to the crossmember then welded the mount to that, my certifier requested this also, spreads the load, hence no cracking ; just a thought ;D
(http://i326.photobucket.com/albums/k435/hunterbynature/stevospics152.jpg)
(http://i326.photobucket.com/albums/k435/hunterbynature/DSCF1766.jpg)
(http://i326.photobucket.com/albums/k435/hunterbynature/DSCF1770.jpg)
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Watch this space, some good info, photos and prices to follow
Regards
Petrolhead
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Check these out from K&K crossmembers in Qld. You can order them to suit any track width(what's a Beddie?) they accept Jag components and come with a engineers certificate
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The bare crossmember is $750.00 inc. postage and the coil over shocks are$650.00
Regards
Petrolhead
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careful with those crossmembers guys they are set up parallel and as the jag is set up with sweeping arms (for anti dive /squat characteristics ) the third arms (at the stubs) are shorter and they will foul the lower control arms .the only solution is to fit steering stops limiting the turning circle (just the thing for beddies) I have invested over 350 hours in r&d on my Jag/Bedford f/ends and it has come down to manufacturing longer third arms which will be an expensive engineering nightmare Cheers Neil
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hey merlin dont you wish we were machines, so we could just charge battery while still working:) i do anyway.
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heres a pic of my Jag rear, still uses the original cage. It was the first Bedford in Australia to get the jag rear, was done in the late 1970's
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